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opa 627bp in MHZS cd33

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 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-8 11:16:14 | 顯示全部樓層
hi windwss,

Blackgate N series non polarization ecap will it better than (SCR solen +0.1 wima black box)? since the cost is similar....

upto your taste.
scr solen + wima high notes and speed will better.
Blackgate will be powful.


I think use same value of original will be save.

Thanks.
SSWONG 發表於 2006-11-8 11:41:43 | 顯示全部樓層
thank you viewer!!

Then i prefer Blackgate loh since i like powerful sound.....

By the way, my coupling cap for opamp is 2.2uF (Evox Rifa MMK) do u think i can use smaller uF like 0.22 or 0.33 to reduce cost?
My headache is most of my cap is using quite high uF compare to CD33 so the cost of modification is much higher... : (
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-8 11:51:01 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi windwss,

you can changed to SCR solen 2.2uf/400v or 2.2 uf/630v
costs around $50 each in hk.
SCR solen 70% = Mitil-cap ppfxs
because both material is tin foil.

SCR solen low costs high gain.

Thanks.
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-8 22:52:00 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi viewer,

will get the OPA627 tomolo, n plug in to cdp on sat, hope got BIG BIG improvement, i really hope       
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-8 23:49:51 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi superwhite,

good news, i will waiting your good news on opa627 la!!!!!!!!!!!!!


thanks.
h3d 發表於 2006-11-9 06:41:42 | 顯示全部樓層

a new drawing (old vs new)

Hi Superwhite

I haven't tried the WE 396A with the cryo treatment. That could be a very nice combination.

By the way I was suprised at the comparison of the Bendix, Sungsol and .. I would have thought the Bendix would win overall, but that was not the case.

Here is a drawing of the old and the new situation. Hopefully that will help.

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SSWONG 發表於 2006-11-9 10:01:17 | 顯示全部樓層
Dear all,

I apologize on the unclear statement on tube comparison.

Actually i have 2 tungsol and 2 bendix tube all 4 tube is used tube not the new 1.
Both the tungsol tube is made on different date i guess as the logo/word written on the tube and the construction slightly different. The tungsol tube on the picture with golden word 2C51 sound slightly better than the other tungsol tube.

For Bendix, same case, both tube made in different year with different label. 1 is ~1950 another 1 is later. My comment yesterday is base on the newer bendix tube in picture (run in for 15minute only). But when i test the old bendix tube which have a red mark on the bottom lastnight i will say i love the bendix old tube very much. This old tube give music, it make people to enjoy the music and neglect to analyse its performance. I just love it's natural sounding, the pace is just right for me. Tungsol sometimes slightly harsh at high, sound lighter and not that musical compare to old bendix.

This sat i will bring it to superwhite to reconfirm the result, we will compare direct to WE396, even though i feel that the old bendix is better but the best way is to copmare on the spot. As i only listen once on WE396A last month when superwhite bring it here.

Tonight i will listen again to the newer bendix as last time i just listen to it for less than an hour, i shall run in it for more time to see whether it will behave like to old bendix afetr more run in time.....

Viewer & superwhite,
I had add a ERO KP1836 0.022uF parallel to my solen 1uF cap, result is encouraging.....

With the bendix tube and the littel mod i had made i'm temporary satisfy with result.....
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-9 13:26:57 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi h3d,

thanks for the diagram, need more time to digest :wink:

want to try out the WE396A cryogenically treated tube , but the budget run out :cry: (damn expansive)

Hi WINDWSS,

sure, bring the tube n cd player this sat morning, we try out together, at the same time i will change all the AUDIOLAB 8000P(my friend Pamp) cap to Black Gate too, n also change the OPA627 for my cd player. will have more update pic soon......
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-9 17:32:31 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi.

Just get my OPA627, price abit high, but still o,k. :wink:
with 2 BG NX NI-Q 0.47 50V.



will install on this coming sat
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-9 17:44:16 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi superwhite,

good looking.

you will found that you cdp have 30% sound stage improvment, when you installed it.

Hope to hearing from you soon.

Thanks.
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-9 17:51:50 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi superwhite,

I have one thing to remind you, when you install it in you dcp you must make sure that the direction of opa.


Thanks.
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-9 18:13:55 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi viewer,

Many many thanks for advice, will make sure collect only solder. :wink:

By the way, i tot you said want to find WE396A to try out? any news?
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-9 18:40:29 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi superwhite,

I try WE396a aldy from my fried. I feel it very warm sound (tube sound) a little bit slow. like a ox wine.

But ,I am like GW5679w Jan more . very clear and detail. Like red wine.
may be later to change.


Thanks.
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-9 19:02:47 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi viewer,,

     that why i call the WE396A, warm n sweet, if it match with silver component, like Mundorf Silver/Oil n black gate(fast cap), it will be fast too. it very depand on initial setup, once find the best tube, stick to the one, from there only Mod until suit to individual taste.

my 2cent,  :wink: stick to the tube that you feel comfortable

Thanks for sharing
SSWONG 發表於 2006-11-10 08:54:34 | 顯示全部樓層
[quote:cf3e7a53dd="viewer"]Hi superwhite,

I try WE396a aldy from my fried. I feel it very warm sound (tube sound) a little bit slow. like a ox wine.

But ,I am like GW5679w Jan more . very clear and detail. Like red wine.
may be later to change.


Thanks.[/quote]

I have the similar feel on WE396 like u, feel that it is lack of a bit ohmmm & excitement.... not that suit me :p  u r using GW5679w or GE5670w?
SSWONG 發表於 2006-11-10 16:54:00 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi Viewer,

According to the article in the hififever column, we can use a tung-sol 6X4 tube & IRF830 to make improvement, do u think this can be apply in our player?
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-10 17:13:07 | 顯示全部樓層
hi windwss,

it can be used in our cdp.

Thanks.
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-11 16:24:16 | 顯示全部樓層
hi viewer,

yes! just put in the opa627 :wink: , wau!!!!!!! now i can know the location of each instrument... :shock: will let it run first, will update you again!

Thanks for sharing. :wink:
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-11 17:02:30 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi viewer & h3d,

want to ask you something, the Pic below, is using 100uf100V, but the board is writen 220uf63V :?  so which 1 need to follow? if i change to 220uf 63V, any sound changes?



Thanks :wink:
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-11 20:00:52 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi superwhite,

I also replace it to Jensen 10uf/150v, sound is very good.
I think if replace to 220uf is no problem, it will be more prowful, but a litte bit affect in high notes.
I suggect to follow same value of 100uf.

I would like to know what the result the cdps meeting today.
how much of the 627au with pcb and black gate ????

Thanks for sharing.
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-11 21:00:49 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi viewer,

after MOD opa627, i switch on the cdp, n put in the the 1st song, sound no change(same) , after that i change to 2nd CD(ROUND UP) wau!!!!! something different, the riding horse part from left to right is was so CLEAR! (but it still NOT up to my expectation, so i let the player run for 3 hour. n play the CHAI CHEN song, OH MY GOD, it totally different,  the vocal n instrument was so real! . viewer you are right! it really REAL now(last time is CLEAR). will let it run for long to see any improvement n share again. thanks viewer!           

i still prefer the WE396A even i have use WINDWSS's BENDIX tube, it actually slightly better than WE, but i want VOCAL, for vocal BENDIX cant get close to WE, bcoz the vocal is outside of the speaker if using WE.
my 2cent, thanks for WINDWSS for the tube. :wink:
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-11 21:04:55 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi viewer,

the price is about USD62, it all in, i like the small BG cap, it cute. will up date some PIC soon...... :wink:

Thanks for sharing.
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-11 22:29:31 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi superwhite,

Do you want make your cd 33 have 20% improvement ???

answer is very simply as follow:

Only change the clock to 1ppm la !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just HK$100
Photo as follow:

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superwhite 發表於 2006-11-12 17:27:04 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi viewer,

Look interesting! :shock:  but will see got stock over here or not. Thanks for advice, want to get 1pair of NOS WE396A first, before i move to other thing. :wink:

can tell any different after change the clock??     

thanks for sharing.
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-12 17:41:46 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi all,

My latest up date pic with opa627 n BG NH cap at power supply circuit. :wink:


Thanks for sharing.
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-12 23:19:48 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi superwhite,

Very nice photo.
If you can find the clock in your place, i very recomment to install it.
when installed it, you are un-belive your cdp will provided Hi-end sound.
(solid, clear, background  silent, powful and musical).


Thanks for sharing.
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-13 00:58:08 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi viewer,

Thanks for info, will try to look for it, but can i know what model no.?
SSWONG 發表於 2006-11-13 09:31:11 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi Viewer,

May i know in HK where can get old part for monitor audio (bronze 3's tweeter) or to repair the tweeter? My friend 's tweeter seems burn, it is not totally mute but still with some shh shh sound. he may visit HK end of the year. Besides, which shop can get cheap cap like SCR solen fast cap?

Dear all,

Since superwhite change the opa627 then i take his opa2604 lo.... after put in my cdp the detail is more n more clear but i feel like digital feel increase a bit....genrally the pros is more than cons (is this the reason make h3d to bypass the opa?? unfortunately my Bada HD-21 circuit is slightly differnt from cd33, thus i can't copy exactly the bypass circuit of h3d)

For the tube testing, WE is no doubt a good tube for vocal (it more focus/emphasis on mid especially vocal so nice & sweet) but lack of bass extention anyway for those who who like vocal &using floorstand speaker it is 1 of the best tube. I think superwhite wll not cahnge to any tube other than WE396A haha.
But for people who like instrumental music and using bookshelf like me, Bendix old tube seems more suitable as it is slightly more balance than WE396A and have better low frequency extention. The vocal though not as sweet n warm as WE396A but it is quite natural.

Viewer, if WE396A not your cup of tea then try this bendix. But take note that the bendix old tube is not label as bendix, it label with ECLIPSE-PIONEER the initial name of Bendix red bank division (with red mark at bottom), a used tube is ~USD6-7.
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-13 09:31:26 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi WINDWSS,

so any different after replace with opa2604, got improvement?
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-13 09:35:48 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi WINDWSS,

look like you got to SOFTEN the sound, before that my CDP also very digital, just replace some KIWAME beside the tube or the 3 resistor at the power supply will be much better...  :wink:

can your friend help me to buy some RIKEN RMG resistor? :  :
Thanks!
SSWONG 發表於 2006-11-13 10:27:12 | 顯示全部樓層
superwhite,

u r exactly right... i need to soften it... using WE396A can soften a bit but don't 12 follow your trend ha..ha....

so will try change resistor later....

which part of hk to get the rmg resistor? just give the resistor value, in case he confirm to go there will ask for his favour....

will email my audiolab 8000A photo for ur advice.
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-13 14:02:47 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi windwss;


The Jensen and solen authorized dealer in Hong Kong as follow web site:
www.soundexplorer.com
other place :
www.vocativeaudio.com
other shops in APLUI STREET,SHUM SHUI PO.KOWLOON Hong Kong
there are many shops can buy the parts.

Hi superwhite,
No model number. you can try to find 1ppm clock in your place. the sales may known what you want. good luck.

Other if windwss's friend go to Hk, may ask him to buy it in this shop :
http://www.diykits.com.hk/

Thanks for sharing.
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-13 14:13:47 | 顯示全部樓層
hi superwhite,

otherwise, you can buy it's kit  from HiFifever. call kk, he will help you to buy install it.
http://www.hififever.com/forum/download.php?id=4516
http://www.hififever.com/forum/download.php?id=4525
http://www.hififever.com/forum/download.php?id=4526

if you add full set of clock kit the costs is high but big improve.
only replace clock is quite good. upto you.


thanks.
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-13 14:33:34 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi viewer,

actually i want the CJ PV3, easy, less component n  great performance(price good  also), but have to wait..... . (too many thing to buy) :  :  :

Thanks!

P/s: 1 of my friend will get the cd33 today, because i everyday 放毒.... :  :  :
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-13 15:03:16 | 顯示全部樓層
hi viewer,

sorry, i tot the preamp kit :  :  : , look very complicated clock, will consider thanks. :wink:
SSWONG 發表於 2006-11-14 09:09:15 | 顯示全部樓層
[quote:05ee75a907="superwhite"]Hi viewer,

actually i want the CJ PV3, easy, less component n  great performance(price good  also), but have to wait..... . (too many thing to buy) :  :  :

Thanks!

P/s: 1 of my friend will get the cd33 today, because i everyday 放毒.... :  :  :[/quote]

Ha... u too bad, always poison people, lucky my "定力够" if not now pocket "kong" whole player with blackgate!

i now temporary shift to use tung-sol tube to reduce digital feel....tung-sol is quite elastic with tube feel.....

later i may take a challenge to replace to 100uF/100v with 100uF/50v cap.... if the 2nd time measured voltage still <50v.
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-14 14:43:03 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi WINDWSS,

GOD BLESS YOU! :roll:  :roll:  :roll:
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-14 14:47:16 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi all Sifu,

Pls HELP! my CDP after install the opa627 for second day, i notice got soft NOISE, the 3rd day the sound increase! the sound something like a playing the LP sound.(when the LP tape is dirty)
is it because of OPA627? or the tube? or maybe len dirty?

PLEASE HELP :cry:  :cry:  :cry:  :cry: tthanks

if cant cancel the sound maybe bypass the opamp :roll:  :roll:  :roll:
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-14 16:46:21 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi superwhite,

1. May be the tube have problem, you can try change it back to 6n3 test????

2.May be the opa627au fixed not well, is it fixed on IC base ???

3.Check all solder point of souns pcb?????

4.Changed back opa 2604 ????????

5. It may be the black gate 0.47uf. because normally use 0.1uf. I am not sure than is it bigger uf will affected the 627au.

I also use 627am metal package with 0.1uf/630v film caps no problem found.

if you changed back opa 2604 and tube 6n3 also got noise, check the ground of outup at RCA with PCB or the black box beside of the RCA outup.

Hope to help you to soft problem.

Thanks.
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-14 17:09:47 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi superwhite,

I have exprience on it in my pocket headphone amp, when i changed it from 627ap to opa627bp the result same to you cdp, when i changed it back, the problem softed.
i check data sheet, the gain have some different. so i think you have same problem, if changed it back to 2604 first, if no problem that the gain of cdp33
not suitable on 627au. or 627au is samll package they will affect by heat.

anyway change it back to opa2604 first.


thanks.
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-14 17:14:19 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi superwhite,

I have try the following opa also no problem.
1.NE5534; singal amp
2.opa2228;
3.opa134; single amp
4.opa797; single amp
5.opa2134;
6.AD827; and
7.opa2111;
8.LT1057;
9.opa2604.

thanks.
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-14 17:23:19 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi viewer,

Thanks for your help, will put the opa2604 back to try :cry:  :cry:  :cry:

But i like the 627 sound, 2604 since too blur for me now . any same with 627 or maybe 627am or 627bp will be better? according my DIY shop said he also got this problem, not match :cry:  :cry:  :cry:. maybe will try like h3d case, bypass the opamp, but dont know the sound quality how?
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-14 18:33:05 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi viewer,

today try to measure the voltage of the opa, WAU!!!!!!!  :shock:  :shock: 29.25V  :shock:  :shock: , it actually over VOLTAGE!!!!!!, i measure the PIN 4(-)   PIN8(+) i got the above reading! is my measure correct?

Can i reduce the votage to the opamp by changing some resistor?
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-14 18:34:58 | 顯示全部樓層
hi superwhite,

I suggest you if the problem soft when you changed back to opa2604, you can used OPA627AM or OPA627BP with 0.1uf standard package. same to our cdp33's photo before.


thanks.
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-14 18:37:30 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi viewer,

actually i already solder the 2604 to WINDWSS cdp :  :

Is the TEXAS INTRUMENT opa627 same as Burr-brown opa627?
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-14 18:56:19 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi superwhite,

the pin 4 & 7 of 627 should be -15 and +15 volts respectively to ground. Check again, may be this is the fault.

TEXAS INTRUMENT opa627 is same as Burr-brown opa627 because BB is belong to TEXAS INTRUMENT.

You sd bypass opm with resistors, it depend on the resistor quailty and are you well in cdp33's  electric layout.
don't try it.  if you are not  really expert on it, it will be burn. becare !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks.
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-14 18:59:19 | 顯示全部樓層
hi superwhite,

enclosed my opa627am with 0.1uf/630v film caps.

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superwhite 發表於 2006-11-14 19:01:08 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi viewer,

just now try again on pin4 n ground using my SANWA multimeter,

the voltage is 15V but the voltage will slowly drop unlimited........? is this correct?
 樓主| viewer 發表於 2006-11-14 19:10:20 | 顯示全部樓層
Hi superwhite,

try again on pin4 n pin7 using your SANWA multimeter,
one point touch pin 4 one point touch ground.
one point touch pin 7 one point touch ground.
the action is separted.
don't one point touch pin4 and one point touch pin7 at the same time.

try again. and let me know.

thanks.
superwhite 發表於 2006-11-14 20:14:32 | 顯示全部樓層
[quote:e999f3c9c7="viewer"]Hi superwhite,

try again on pin4 n pin7 using your SANWA multimeter,
one point touch pin 4 one point touch ground.
one point touch pin 7 one point touch ground.
the action is separted.
don't one point touch pin4 and one point touch pin7 at the same time.

try again. and let me know.

thanks.[/quote]

the ground is it at the same board, bcoz the board got the ground, n i try out is about 19V at initial, than will keep on dropping until no voltage..... :?  :? why ah?
or i have to measure at  the earth ground with pin 4 n pin7?
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